Katherine Nelson-Riley: Daniel, I'm really excited about listening to what Michaela's bringing to the REITE Club this afternoon.
Daniel St Jean: I am too because, um, anytime I'm gonna be having conversation with somebody who's obsessed with customer service. I always find that very interesting and educational.
Katherine Nelson-Riley: She's been a restauranteur, she's been an entrepreneur who basically lives inside the customer service line. And exactly as you say, her entire being is about customer service. So even though she's bringing, I guess 15 years in that food and beverages industry many differences in the corporations and she's hired hundreds of employees over time.
She's got so much that she's bringing as well as in her position, um, with Lend as their, um, their partners and customer success manager. I'm really looking forward to what she's got to share with me.
Daniel St Jean: Yep, me too. And of course, we're going to try and get a little bit of information out of her about Lend Eye and why people should pay attention to Lendai.
Katherine Nelson-Riley: And about investing, Canadians investing and how to do that as they finance that in the US.
Daniel St Jean: Yes. All right. So are we ready?
Katherine Nelson-Riley: Absolutely. Let's get onto the, to the podcast. And Macau welcomes so much to the REITE Club podcast this afternoon.
Michal Liviatan: Thank you both for having me. Thank you for the opportunity to participate in this great podcast. I'm excited to share my story. My name is Michal Liviatan. I'm based in Toronto. I'm the head of the Canadian arm of Lendai. Lendai is a US private lender focusing on financing foreigners only for nationals, only investing south of the border in the US.
We are a tech based company, so financial technology, um, Everything is online. We are working in a b2b, meaning business to business model. I'm partnering up with other professionals, um, realtors, brokers, uh, in influencers such as the REITE Club. And whatnot. Anyone who can touch the, uh, foreign investor and US real estate.
We're currently operating from four countries around the world. We have our headquarters in Miami, Florida. We have my office in Toronto. We have a small London office in the UK responsible for the investors and another tech and development center and a big office in Israel. Where and how I got into all this is another story.
Katherine Nelson-Riley: We'd love to hear it cuz I also, when you said that you were also down in the Bahamas, Florida.
Michal Liviatan: I said Miami, Florida,
Katherine Nelson-Riley: Miami, Florida. Okay. I knew that was so myself, because if I recall in one of our earlier conversations at one point that you were also have interest in DJ and music making and learning and I, you know, I just had this vision of, you know, all that great vibe that happens down in southern Florida and that Caribbean, Southern Florida vibe.
Michal Liviatan: As a young adult? I would say maybe when I started my way 15 years ago, I had two dreams. One of them was to be a dj. And I said to myself, I'm gonna, I'm gonna, um, be a musician. I love music, I played a few instrument instruments in my past and then developed into electronic music.
And this was part of my creative me, the artistic side of me. And I thought, I'm gonna go. But then I went to my, more, towards my other dream, and that was to be just a teller at the bank. Um, and I said, um, if, if the DJ stuff wouldn't work, I'm gonna be a teller at the bank and I'm gonna, and I'm gonna do my, you know, I'm customer service oriented.
I'm customer service centric, uh, customer service and people is my obsession. And I'm, and I also love financials, um, and, uh, and, uh, learning about, uh, uh, finance and economy and whatnot. And so I'm gonna be a teller at the bank. So none of that happened. I didn't turn to be a DJ nor a teller at the bank.
But it still motivates me because I'm saying the worst case scenario. If anything goes wrong, I can always go be a teller at the bank or a DJ. So, and, you know, in the worst case I can make my dreams come true. And then I kinda went sideways when I was, um, traveling the world. Um, and I arrived in Canada early 2000 and.
So 12 years ago, um, where I met, um, Uh, a guy who's, uh, today my husband and the father of my children. Children, lovely. And so, so I, I follow that path and, um, I was very open to the opportunities that came my way. Uh, I was a young entrepreneur. Very curious, um, willing to learn. Um, I left my country. I was born and raised in Israel. Left my country, started to explore the world, and then the opportunity came, and I got into customer service and food and beverage. Business where I opened my first business, um, started as a franchisee, uh, in a fairly big franchise. I think they have 50 locations in Canada. We're not gonna mention names.
That doesn't matter. But, I fell in love with the service. To me, it didn't matter if I sold lattes or not. Any, anything else you can sell. I just liked the opportunity to communicate with people and the dynamic environment, my day to day.
Katherine Nelson-Riley: Well, that's a perfect bit because as it, as it's come along all this, this, this time with your love of customer service and you excel at it like you're, you're the partners and customer success manager for Lendai.
Michal Liviatan: I couldn't do it without my past in the food industry, in the food business. I couldn't be successful in what I'm doing today in the financial sector, high tech real estate sector.
I could not do that without coming from the food business. It's so far away from each other, but, Um, the, let's, let's say, let's say the other way, the, the finance, um, world is not customer centric. It's just not, no. There are many other things to focus on. Um, many regulations and, and rules and very strict rules of doing things and operating in a square box.
If you're not fitting in that square box as an employee or as a client. It doesn't work. And I took it all. I've learned in the customer business, customer service, food business, and I implemented it on the finance aspect of the thing. I'm not the typical banker you will meet that's gonna say, oh, it's five and one minute, I'm gone.
I'm ghosting everybody. Nobody can reach me till tomorrow at nine. I am, um, sense of urgency is my, again, my obsession. My clients, um, I put them first, I put them, I want them to feel comfortable and especially when it comes to mortgages, very stressful times. Um, when we take out a mortgage from the minute we sign that purchase agreement until the actual transaction is completed, uh, it's very stressful.
Katherine Nelson-Riley: The areas that I think that you excel in as well is that because you are basically west Lendai us but you, as you, as you say, you speak Canadian.
Michal Liviatan: That's right.
Katherine Nelson-Riley: So it's so very important to be able to translate because of knowing what the rules and regulations are for investors coming from Canada to invest in the US and also to understand the nuances within the US market and how to best, um, translate and make sure that it is the best win-win for everybody and that nothing is falling through the crack.
I know it a couple of times. So when, when we've had conversations, um, I've had, um, I've had questions because I, I don't understand how that translation works. And, and you were able to literally, speakeasy language that I could understand and relate to. I mean, you do have quite the talent.
Michal Liviatan: I agree. I think that, um, one of the biggest advantages of Landi, if you ask me today, you know, before or during pandemic, it was a different conversation. Uh, the market was way open. Um, people were rushing to offer low interest rates, um, all time low at interest rate, higher evaluations. Um, for properties, uh, brought almost like Canadians were flocking to the US looking for the opportunity.
And now things are tightened up again. Securitization companies, um, being very strict. With companies like us, private lenders, non QM lenders, where we keep rolling the note to different hands. We're not keeping the mortgage on our books. So there are securitization companies buying those notes from us.
Everybody's tightened up. They wanna do more due diligence. Uh, things are taking. Uh, longer. Um, so, uh, longer, longer, uh, turnarounds, um, more documents. Um, and so now I would say the biggest advantage of Lend is exactly what you said. It's the fact that I'm here and me and my team we're Canadians helping Canadians investing in the US same time zone.
Speaking the Canadian language, I can communicate with the client on the last Blue Jay's game. Um, I, I also know everything about US financing. So the alternative of that would be to tell the Canadian investor, you go ahead, the US is a huge place. Um, go ahead and find your lender. Right? Where do you start?
I use that and I really, really see the value of, of Canadians or Canadians working in a US company, helping Canadians secure their financing for their investments in the us. It's priceless.
Daniel St Jean: So, Macau, when, when did the Lendai start?
Michal Liviatan: So we started in early 2019. Not long ago, we're three years old. We have started as, so I mean the founders, there are four founders. Um, and then two things. One, we're all foreigners to the US so we know what it feels when a foreign national is coming to the us. And seek for, you know, seeking mortgages. Um, and we also know the other hand of foreigners going into their, in their origin country looking for a mortgage on a US rental investment.
We've been there and done that. And we're also all of us investing in the US as foreigners. So we knew, um, uh, Where it's, uh, the most painful for the foreign investor. And it doesn't matter if you are Canadian or, or German, um, they, they will treat you. The US will treat you as a foreign national, uh, with your own, um, you know, terms and rates that you will be getting.
Of course, Canada has more opportunities in terms of, uh, private lenders that will look at the four National than a German. But still in terms of, uh, terms and rates, it's uh, it's the same, uh, Um, and so, uh, yeah, the beginning of Lend Eye was kind of hit and miss. We didn't know where is it was going to go?
And then a very successful, uh, seed funding of, uh, 35 million, uh, came into, uh, fruition where. Uh, we saw the development, um, and we drew almost triple, uh, the size of the company. So currently, I think, um, like I said, four offices around the world, uh, between 60 and 70 employees. Um, looking forward, uh, to, um, to, uh, be a a, a very, be the go-to lender for foreign nationals, uh, around the.
Daniel St Jean: So Mi um, let's, let's compare, here's what I'd like to do. What was, where were, where were Canadians investing mo most say three years ago, um, before the pandemic and before the, you know, all the changes here and where are they investing or what, where are they buying now as it, has there been any change or is it pretty much the same as it was three years ago?
Michal Liviatan: So I would say, pre-pandemic. Let's start from the beginning. First of all, it's important to say that Canada represents most of the four nationals investing in the us. Um, it's always head to head with China, but always a little bit above, representing a little bit more of investors.
Canadians love to go anywhere. Just south of the border. So I would say, a driving distance. So we can see, Michigan is very strong, especially these days. Uh, we can talk about how the lower markets are surprising us with higher rental incomes these days.
But we have the big ones. We have around 3% in California. Another 6% in New York. We have 3% in Hawaii. Canada loves Hawaii. Very surprising. Yeah. We have a, um, A higher number. I'm sorry, I can't, it's not, it's not really off the badge, but a higher number in Arizona, of course, when we go with our, you know, our golf gear and, and heading to Arizona to those gated communities and, and, and, uh, And, you know, obviously the, the good weather and 42%, um, of course would be Florida.
42% of Canadians. Yes, of all Canadians, 42% go to Florida. I speak in general, uh, not only, um, uh, rental investments, but also for snowbirds, um, that are really moving. Um, as a, you know, an occupied owner investment, uh, for six months of the year, October to April. They're gonna be in Florida, in their own second home.
This is something we're, we're still not touching at, at Lend, we're still aiming ourselves for the rental investment only and non occupied owner. Um, and so, uh, yeah, we're operating in all of those. States where Canadians go accept Hawaii. Uh, this is, um, uh, a place that we're looking forward to being, but not yet.
And post pandemic, uh, we can see how, you know when. Especially with this situation right now, like I said, the market is tightened up. Interest rates are going up. We're going into a correction followed by a recession in the US and that's where investors are also starting to look at a short term rental, more than a long term, uh, you know, to increase obviously profit, right? So, Florida, Florida, Florida, Florida again.
Daniel St Jean: Well see, I was, uh, born many, many, many years ago in the fifties, and I lived in Quebec. And when you lived in Montreal, uh, back then in the fifties and sixties, people would go to Florida because they could drive to Florida in two and two, two and a half days.
So it looks like things haven't changed much for Canadians because like I said, 60 years ago, Florida was the main destination, at least for people in Quebec. And now it looks like Florida is still among the top, investing destinations for Canadians.
Michal Liviatan: But like I said, the model has changed.So Florida didn't change. We still like the Sunbelt. We're still gonna enjoy the warm weather and uh, and obviously the opportunities in the market. But what have. Tremendously. Uh, pre pandemic, post pandemic would be the model, the business model of where the investor is going, uh, from a long term investment or, you know, a 30 year fixed rate.
Long term rental to the short term rental, Airbnb, v r Bs, and another 12 channels for, you know, short term rental to, uh, increase, uh, return on investment cash on cash return and whatnot.
Daniel St Jean: So we can still make money in Florida.
Michal Liviatan: Absolutely, .So a
Katherine Nelson-Riley: quick question. Um, one of the, the areas in Canada, because of the way that the rules and regulations are and the changes that are coming in with the, uh, for the, for the investors and the short term rentals, a lot of the investors are, um, are moving into the midterm market.
Are you seeing anything towards a midterm market in Florida or any of the other places?
Michal Liviatan: We are looking at a few different options of new products that will come in. So right now, we're still at a 30 year fixed rate. We wanna do justice to our investors and we want to adjust our products and our options with the market.
I mean, you have to. In movement, when you're in the non QM private lending sector, you have to stay, I would say, uh, innovate and, and find where, um, where you can go according to the market. And so we are looking at bridge loans that are coming up and also the shorter term. And the shorter term really goes to, um, or correlates with prepayment penalty.
When you can break the loan or when you have zero prepayment penalty, that's gonna make it much easier to pay off. Refinance and go to a different direction,
Daniel St Jean: Michal one question that comes to mind here, because I'm doing a lot of investing not in the US but in Costa Rica.
And every time I do that I have to deal with Canadian dollars, which really, uh, is interesting because, uh, Huh. Three months ago I sent money to Costa Rica at one point 27 and two days ago I sent it at one point 37. So what, when people deal with you are all the, uh, the amounts and everything always in US dollars.
In other words, we always know what we're going to have to, to pay as opposed to having a surprise every month.
Michal Liviatan: That's a very good question. Yes. So Lend loans will be provided in US dollars, uh, which will essentially. Uh, minimize your exposure of the exchange rate, right? So if you are gonna take, let's say a new purchase loan, you're gonna bring 30%, you're gonna exchange 30% of your Canadian money, and we'll get another 70% financing in US dollars.
Daniel St Jean: Katherine.
Katherine Nelson-Riley: Interesting, interesting. Um, so we've moved into the, uh, portion of our podcast, recording here.
Michal Liviatan: more lightning round. That was very fast. I'm enjoying the conversation, but I would enjoy more the, uh, the next. Um, we have
Katherine Nelson-Riley: Our lightning round questions that are coming up. Is there anything, actually, before we end that you that you like to?
Michal Liviatan: Not at the moment, no. We will have more sessions, uh, with the right club, uh, where I'm gonna talk more and elaborate more on the educational, more the educational informational part of, uh, of, uh, us. Uh, financing. I'm gonna talk about, uh, US real estate because you can't understand US mortgage rates and US financing without talking a little bit about the market the relevant markets.
In that's also coming up this week. So, the REITE club will have the opportunity to hear more from Lendai.
Katherine Nelson-Riley: Absolutely that will be, uh, that will be coming up and we always have, have our, um, the information, uh, that people can go and find it as ever, or evergreen content on our website, which is www.thereiteclub.com.
And that's where we have our references and they'll also be able to find you and how to connect with you, um, which is always awesome. But let's move along to our lightning-round questions.
Katherine Nelson-Riley: What is the best advice you've ever received from another investor or at a networking event?
Michal Liviatan: Best advice, do not wait to buy real estate. Buy real estate. And wait Warren Buffet said it first. It's coming up on every other, webinar and it's very, true, especially these days. Do not try to time the market never.
Katherine Nelson-Riley: Excellent.
Michal Liviatan: what is the attribute that has made you successful?
I am motivated by, um, by my family. I'm seeking success. Um, so why? So I can provide and, and, you know, give my kids and my family everything that I, that I can and everything that I didn't have.
Daniel St Jean: So, in other words, your why is your motivator.
Michal Liviatan: Yes, I agree.
Daniel St Jean: All right, Catherine, continue.
Katherine Nelson-Riley: So your real estate investing, that's one thing that we didn't, uh, touch too, too much on. Because you yourself are also a real estate investor, correct?
Michal Liviatan: Correct, yes.
Katherine Nelson-Riley: Just very quickly, in about 30 seconds. What, where is your main area of real estate investing?
Michal Liviatan: So, of course I'm here, where I live that would be Richmond Hill, just north of Toronto. Back in the day, me and my husband were looking into Hamilton. So, we did some, uh, improvements there and, uh, and got six units in Hamilton held and used to be still is, but but used to be, uh, a very big, uh, destination for investors, uh, in Canada and, uh, in the US I look at the lower market, lower value markets, not necessarily going into the, uh, 400,00 - 500,000, US dollars by staying, where it's, uh, lower and, um, it's not, there's still more room to appreciate.
Like we see lately, market rent analysis goes up. Uh, we see a, a huge. In those lower markets. Okay. And that's where I am .
Katherine Nelson-Riley: What, with your real estate investing that you are doing yourself, and I realize that you are Lendai, but outside of Lendai of course what's your favorite resource for real estate investing?
Michal Liviatan: Oh, good question. I use a lot of inventory, companies in the US, one of my favorite ones. And I also know, uh, the owners and the team. Uh, rent to Retirement. Rent to retirement.com. Shout out. They really like myself, customer service centric transparency.
And that's what I like. I want to set the expectations from the get go. Give me everything now. Don't waste my time. I'm not gonna waste yours. And we both want, uh, a successful transaction as a lender or as a, um, other professional in the real estate industry, but also as a, uh, obviously isn't the investor.
We don't wanna waste anyone's time. Um, and time is of the essence. So, uh, uh, rent a retirement, shout out. Oh, that's cool.
Katherine Nelson-Riley: I had never heard of that. Daniel, had you heard of them before?
Daniel St Jean: No, can you repeat?
Michal Liviatan: renttoretirement.com an inventory company. They're holding lots of inventory in the US. It's a US company. Zach, the owner, has a great team of professionals. And you're looking at the ROI, you're looking at the NOI. You want transparency. You don't wanna see those market brands or you know, the analysis of professionals. And all of a sudden the lender is doing the due diligence and you're finding more and more and more expenses, and all of a sudden your ROI from 15 turns into a six or an eight.
What they represent. Is the real picture. And, yeah, I really like to work with them and I trust them. I think trust is a big one. Absolutely.
Daniel St Jean: Rent to retire.
Michal Liviatan: Rent to retirement.
Daniel St Jean: Americans like to use rent two or four as using a digit in there.
Michal Liviatan: One word, rent to retirement.com. Uh, you can see the inventory and uh, yeah. Thank you.
Daniel St Jean: So you mentioned earlier that you have kids. Um, can I ask you how many kids you.
Michal Liviatan: Yeah. So, uh, it's actually a funny question, um, because, uh, right now during the, you can see my bottom part of, uh, uh, of the, of my body, but, uh, uh, going on my pregnancy right now.
Thank you so much. I appreciate it. I didn't expect this question to come up. I have another wonderful five and a half year old that's now in school and very excited for Halloween.
Daniel St Jean: Yes, of course. All right.
Katherine Nelson-Riley: That's gonna be fun tonight for sure. So, uh, and, and you know, one of the things that I, I know that, uh, the right club, our tagline is to customize your life.
Laurel and Danielle have just come back from six weeks of travel throughout, uh, Greece and, uh, parts of Europe, and, uh, they're taking off again to Costa Rica, and then they're taking off again to Portugal.
Michal Liviatan: Wow.
Katherine Nelson-Riley: Number of our, uh, you know, our team, we've got one team member that's heading down to New Zealand for three weeks, and we've got others that are down in Costa Rica and so on and so forth.
Wow. And so many of our community are doing that. Um, and they're, they're utilizing, and that's the catalyst for them to be able to customize their life through real estate. So to wrap up our lightning round questions and, um, uh, if you had one place that you could go and visit, where would that be?
Michal Liviatan: Easy question right now it's Bali. I'm really looking into, uh, Bali, Indonesia. Uh, I was traveling in the past in the far east, uh, India, Laos, Vietnam, Thailand, and all that area. Um, I'm a big, um, fan of, uh, working from anywhere in the world, uh, 95 in one place. Uh, for me and for a company like Lend.
It's in the past. Uh, we work, uh, from anywhere in the world. Uh, we're traveling. I'm traveling, uh, with my family on a regular basis. And, uh, yeah, Bali, Indonesia. Here I come. All right.
Katherine Nelson-Riley: Excellent. So thank you so very much for joining us today, and where can our community be?
Michal Liviatan: Best way to reach me is, always via email. So michal@lendai.us. I'm also on Facebook with my full name, Michal Liviatan Carpenter. Um, I would say these are the most straightforward ways to reach. .
Katherine Nelson-Riley: Well, that's awesome. Thank you so very much for joining us today. You and, uh, and it's learning a lot. I, I'm, uh, I'm looking forward to learning more about investing in the U.S. Yes. Thank you so much for joining us today.
Michal Liviatan: Thank you. Thank you both for having me. And, uh, thank you for another fun day at Work, . Okay, thank you. Cheers.
Daniel St Jean: She did not disappoint, did she? I mean, uh, we were expecting to, uh, hear about, uh, the importance of customer service. Um, and she. She really, uh, . She, she's, she's a customer service maniac. And, uh, but it was also very educational, uh, about, um, how the market has changed before pre covid, after covid, et cetera, et cetera.
I think we learned a lot here. So I'm looking forward to, um, finding out more about Lendi and about the market in the US. I really am. How about you?
Michal Liviatan: Absolutely.
Katherine Nelson-Riley: I thought it was excellent. And the way that she also mentioned which markets are the ones that Canadians are investing in down in the states as well as, Where she herself goes to for her resources, um, in order for her own personal investing, which is always great and what makes the choices and what to look for when you have that.
It was just quite excellent. I know that, uh, her, uh, she has been in the REITE club, a couple of times and we'll be a couple times more. And so any of our, um, listeners, if they'd like to find out more about Lendai about it. Canadians investing the financial, um, how to do it with the financial resources that Lendai has.
Then they can always find everything at Triple w, the wright club.com, and all you have to do is SuperDuper easily. Just make sure to put into the search bar what it is you're looking for. It pops up and it's evergreen content, so it's always there.
Daniel St Jean: All right, as usual, it was fun talking with you, Katherine, and our guests. So until the next one.
Katherine Nelson-Riley: Thanks. You too. Bye, everybody.
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